Benef, Paul, and Trecia kick off the new season with part two of their “Africa Whaaat?” series. The trio interviews Mike Burns, co-owner and managing partner of The Burns Brothers, as they strive to better understand the region and dispel their misconceptions. Mike shares his experience of his first trip to Africa and his company’s mission to demystify the continent.
[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Africa like change it to you. And I'm sure when you all have been there as well, it changes
[00:00:06] [SPEAKER_01]: you no matter who you are no matter where you're from. And so for us we knew it was going
[00:00:10] [SPEAKER_01]: to be important because Global Town Africa's mission is how do we decrease the unemployment
[00:00:16] [SPEAKER_01]: rate on the continent of Africa?
[00:00:23] [SPEAKER_02]: Hi, welcome back y'all to another episode of Aucosota, Rhythm and Roam, my name is FNAF and
[00:00:29] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm here with Paula Trisha. And this is where we discuss tribal adventures, the simulators,
[00:00:35] [SPEAKER_02]: differences, misconceptions all through the lens of culture. And you'll see it looks a little
[00:00:40] [SPEAKER_02]: bit different today because we have a guest joining us. Paul why don't you introduce our guest
[00:00:45] [SPEAKER_02]: to Aucos.
[00:00:48] [SPEAKER_04]: Well, thank you there Benef and yes so we have a special guest with us today and it is the one
[00:00:58] [SPEAKER_04]: we've known each other for years now, you know, through our time and military and station
[00:01:04] [SPEAKER_04]: in different locations and also living in the city as well. And so starting off at West Point
[00:01:13] [SPEAKER_04]: United States Military Academy. So Mike, welcome and we appreciate to be here.
[00:01:20] [SPEAKER_04]: Be me.
[00:01:22] [SPEAKER_01]: The Navy is from the theater. I am a conversation and let's do it, let's go.
[00:01:31] [SPEAKER_03]: I really do want to kind of jump in and Mike, you know, it's appreciative of you being here
[00:01:37] [SPEAKER_03]: but you know we'll get to a little bit of some of those questions that we want to ask you
[00:01:41] [SPEAKER_03]: but I want to really get into really what people want to know. And I think what people really
[00:01:49] [SPEAKER_03]: want to know is, is that dinner with a fictional character? Who would that be?
[00:01:56] [SPEAKER_01]: So with, you know, I can't see. I actually believe that people do want to know that and so it's absolutely
[00:02:03] [SPEAKER_01]: no character which means I then need to kind of make up and like walk through like the characteristics
[00:02:08] [SPEAKER_01]: of this character or is it? Why not? Yes. So I would love if I had the choice to sit down and meet
[00:02:17] [SPEAKER_01]: with the person who has the ability, right? And it's kind of more like a superhero play.
[00:02:24] [SPEAKER_01]: Like has the ability to change people's thoughts? I'd like use it though for, you know, to choose
[00:02:31] [SPEAKER_01]: to change people's thoughts in a way that they can kind of direct them where they want to go
[00:02:35] [SPEAKER_01]: but to change people's thoughts if what they're doing and how they're thinking is not benefiting
[00:02:40] [SPEAKER_01]: the greater society. Right? Okay. Change people's thoughts to where they put themselves
[00:02:45] [SPEAKER_01]: second or third versus putting themselves first but that would be if I could sit down with that
[00:02:51] [SPEAKER_01]: person and we could have dinner and they could tell me how do they not only see
[00:02:57] [SPEAKER_01]: what people are thinking, how do they help reposition? What people think because then maybe I
[00:03:01] [SPEAKER_01]: could even if I couldn't do it as well as they can because they're superhero. Right? Right?
[00:03:05] [SPEAKER_01]: I could take some of those skills and you know kind of push it forward and also try to help
[00:03:12] [SPEAKER_03]: So you're hoping to glean from that as well. You want to try to get as much from that. Well,
[00:03:17] [SPEAKER_03]: look I'm all about taking opportunity so that's a good one. That's a good one. That's a
[00:03:21] [SPEAKER_04]: Mike why don't you just take us through you know kind of an introduction to you know obviously more on
[00:03:26] [SPEAKER_04]: yourself and what you're you and your company is all about and then we'll go in from there.
[00:03:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh sure well so bottom line is I'm a father I'm a husband right first so I have two little boys
[00:03:37] [SPEAKER_01]: who I love to death and actually everything that I do is tied to them so I have a 10-year-old
[00:03:40] [SPEAKER_01]: name-shale sweetest kid in the world like super empathetic
[00:03:46] [SPEAKER_01]: and just cares and loves and feels and then I have a seven year old named dash
[00:03:52] [SPEAKER_01]: who we always say if we had dash first there would be no-shale. Wow second child so that's
[00:03:58] [SPEAKER_01]: is also sweet and amazing but like the world orbits and everything orbits around dash. I don't know if
[00:04:12] [SPEAKER_01]: you all relate to it. Yeah definitely. Definitely a father first I'm a husband I've been
[00:04:18] [SPEAKER_01]: married now coming up on 20 years. Yeah. Congratulations. Congratulations. Congratulations.
[00:04:25] [SPEAKER_01]: And my wife too and this is part of the journey is a full-cary member or was a service member as well
[00:04:31] [SPEAKER_01]: she was a pilot just like me so as Paul said I started my kind of professional career after
[00:04:39] [SPEAKER_01]: West Point graduate in 2000 and then became a pilot not because I wanted to but because I knew
[00:04:45] [SPEAKER_01]: what I didn't want to do like I knew for sure I wanted to actually want to be a lawyer when I love
[00:04:51] [SPEAKER_01]: and we all know who have gone to like the military you can't go to like Jagger be a lawyer right after
[00:04:56] [SPEAKER_01]: graduation. Yes. I knew I didn't want to like march with a backpack on my back so new anyone
[00:05:01] [SPEAKER_01]: went straight and at that point in time I thought I was somewhat claustrophobic as well so I needed
[00:05:05] [SPEAKER_01]: window so I didn't want to be a tank or anything like that. Yeah. Fire thing seems cool so shows
[00:05:11] [SPEAKER_01]: not so not I didn't want to be a pilot so as a little kid not top gun type of stuff but it just
[00:05:16] [SPEAKER_01]: seemed cool thing to do until I become a lawyer but fell in love with flying ended up flying
[00:05:21] [SPEAKER_01]: a patches that took me to doing things like a lot of folks in this college done Afghanistan I
[00:05:27] [SPEAKER_01]: ran where I learned a lot about myself but more importantly I learned a lot about the power people
[00:05:31] [SPEAKER_01]: and people if you think about it are no matter what kind of the world you're in they kind of all
[00:05:37] [SPEAKER_01]: have that universal need for like common things people want to be loved to be value people want
[00:05:42] [SPEAKER_01]: to feel like they're part of a community people want to feel like they're sort of like a winning
[00:05:45] [SPEAKER_01]: formula of something and I could probably say that's what I fell in love with this concept of like
[00:05:51] [SPEAKER_01]: diversity and inclusion but different from way that like corporate America looks at a first
[00:05:56] [SPEAKER_01]: like winning inclusion because when you're working with amazing people and I rack or enough
[00:06:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Afghanistan and you're tapping to their experience and perspective accomplish really difficult
[00:06:04] [SPEAKER_01]: things that's what diversity equipment inclusion was and so when I had the opportunity to come back
[00:06:09] [SPEAKER_01]: to West Point to lead their diversity admissions and enrollment I took a different lens of looking
[00:06:16] [SPEAKER_01]: at the type of person who you wanted at West Point because West Point was very focused on
[00:06:21] [SPEAKER_01]: academics that it should be because of diversity but it was like very narrowly looking at a person
[00:06:27] [SPEAKER_01]: it was like do you have this SAT score? this GPA right and and if you think about what West Point
[00:06:33] [SPEAKER_01]: was trying to develop in the form of like leaders I would say I would much rather look at someone who
[00:06:40] [SPEAKER_01]: was raised in a family with five siblings who mother worked two jobs and had to actually figure out
[00:06:46] [SPEAKER_01]: a work school right good job. right yep right right the attributes of propensity to be
[00:06:55] [SPEAKER_01]: probably be the leader is to solve very complex problems in the army versus the kid who grew up
[00:06:59] [SPEAKER_01]: in eight of state main who had a personal tutor who got a perfect SAT score so that kind of was my first
[00:07:07] [SPEAKER_01]: venture into the Earth's equity inclusion after after my time at the academy which was 13 years
[00:07:12] [SPEAKER_01]: until the army was like oh it's maybe time for me to leave I want to actually see my wife
[00:07:17] [SPEAKER_01]: I want to really start a family I want to do a lot of things that several people in this call
[00:07:22] [SPEAKER_01]: probably know about that the military sometimes limits you because you're at the back of
[00:07:27] [SPEAKER_01]: what the army specifically wants you to do and so here's how was the crazy person who said
[00:07:32] [SPEAKER_01]: you know what I'm thinking I'm going to leave yeah 13 years after you hit the home
[00:07:38] [SPEAKER_01]: which was I was telling you you were crazy how was that but you know one of the things that I
[00:07:44] [SPEAKER_01]: realized and and that I really in the work that we do now at the Burns Brothers push is that
[00:07:49] [SPEAKER_01]: that your worth that you put on yourself it's it's not debatable right like you can't let someone else
[00:07:55] [SPEAKER_01]: someone might determine your value that can be done in like pay and promotion and opportunity
[00:08:00] [SPEAKER_01]: but like you determine work and if that value worth like alignment is off then you have to make
[00:08:07] [SPEAKER_01]: the call that end of the day one at that point in time the army was telling me I was I wanted to actually
[00:08:11] [SPEAKER_01]: take Paul's job to believe it or not he was like the P.A.O. and like near Paul and really good and
[00:08:17] [SPEAKER_01]: helping to position me to be that role you're going to for a poll. I'm right yeah yeah exactly
[00:08:25] [SPEAKER_02]: I actually had like a physical reaction before Paul because I know about it hives.
[00:08:31] [SPEAKER_01]: I remember my options they were like you're going to a fork. Hulk are you're going back
[00:08:36] [SPEAKER_01]: to Iraq because you're well-timing for those who are watching don't know what's like a lot of
[00:08:40] [SPEAKER_01]: things that you haven't deployed and a lot of them for those who don't know what fork
[00:08:44] [SPEAKER_04]: polka is it's in Louisiana in the middle of nowhere Louisiana. So no work in New Orleans.
[00:08:50] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah it's warmer in the middle of nowhere is important because you can defend a lot of people who
[00:08:55] [SPEAKER_04]: this is true this is true this is true this is true but we have to be fair and saying it is in a
[00:09:00] [SPEAKER_04]: middle of nowhere that's the fact you know but it is something it's something if you're from somewhere so
[00:09:06] [SPEAKER_01]: let's put it that way so yeah it's a good somewhere that's right and so at that point time
[00:09:12] [SPEAKER_01]: those were the options that I had go back to Iraq go to formal not do what you thought you should be
[00:09:19] [SPEAKER_01]: doing in the form of like yeah you know that you were going to drive a lot of value to the army
[00:09:22] [SPEAKER_01]: and so I felt my worth was here the value they put on that was here yeah it's like okay well
[00:09:29] [SPEAKER_01]: in that case I'm going to go somewhere to wear my value and my worth are better aligned and then
[00:09:34] [SPEAKER_01]: so I I left the army after that the first job I ever had in corporate America was at city group
[00:09:40] [SPEAKER_01]: to run diversity and it's literally for them so talk about a leap of I mean my only affiliation
[00:09:46] [SPEAKER_01]: bank is I had a checkbook and a credit card I didn't know anything about banking didn't know
[00:09:54] [SPEAKER_01]: really to be honest I didn't know anything about diversity and inclusion but what I knew was
[00:09:57] [SPEAKER_01]: new people once again yeah yeah I knew it was the humans and I figured out it like that's really
[00:10:03] [SPEAKER_01]: what it should be about like a city group it should be not about race gender all those things
[00:10:07] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah it should be about how do you ensure that the individuals who are inside of your
[00:10:12] [SPEAKER_01]: organizations feel like they belong but more importantly how do you bring people inside your
[00:10:15] [SPEAKER_01]: organizations that will make the organization better not for the current but for the future and so
[00:10:19] [SPEAKER_01]: did city from while then got called after my second child was born by organization I never heard
[00:10:25] [SPEAKER_01]: of called conduit and they said we were fortunate 500 company we were the business service arm
[00:10:30] [SPEAKER_01]: of zero ox we've just broken off the go public the first mandate of the board is we got to
[00:10:35] [SPEAKER_01]: create wealth of diversity for our at that time it's like 60,000 employees across it's maybe like 50
[00:10:41] [SPEAKER_01]: so I left city right and and started to build out the diversity also the company called conduit
[00:10:49] [SPEAKER_01]: the cool story about opportunity and why I love the military is that I've never won the
[00:10:54] [SPEAKER_01]: be like full-time like diversity guy like because I truly love business more than diversity yeah
[00:10:59] [SPEAKER_01]: so I wanted to figure out how I could leverage my entry into conduit through diversity but really
[00:11:06] [SPEAKER_01]: figure out how I can be part of the business and not just a diversity guy and it's interesting
[00:11:10] [SPEAKER_01]: how things work for your in your favor but I can't remember the hurricane but there was this hurricane
[00:11:14] [SPEAKER_01]: that came around guess it was around 2013, 14 it was like the one that hit Puerto Rico
[00:11:21] [SPEAKER_01]: hit Houston Dallas it was like this huge hurricane and I think it was a hurricane to where
[00:11:28] [SPEAKER_01]: there's images of like President Trump like throwing like toilet paper or paper towels oh yes yes yes
[00:11:33] [SPEAKER_03]: that was yeah I can't forget it remember exactly where it's name of it but yeah it was pretty big
[00:11:39] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah yeah so it was a big one and we had sites all over the globe at conduit and I remember the
[00:11:46] [SPEAKER_01]: CEO calls off his business leaders and and says give me an update of what's happening with all
[00:11:51] [SPEAKER_01]: of our sites both with your people and with your clients and all the business leaders just look
[00:11:55] [SPEAKER_01]: did know what this is and the young girl said ahead of a chart he's like is it type diversity guy
[00:12:01] [SPEAKER_01]: is it an army guy I'm sure he could figure out how yeah I moved yeah I moved from being the
[00:12:09] [SPEAKER_01]: chief diversity officer to being the head of crisis manager for crisis again yeah immediately that
[00:12:15] [SPEAKER_01]: got me exposure that led to me being the chief of staff for the whole company and then led to
[00:12:20] [SPEAKER_01]: me ultimately running the biggest business line at conduit their call center which I had no
[00:12:25] [SPEAKER_01]: experience with as well from like what I didn't even know what a call center wasn't even know
[00:12:28] [SPEAKER_01]: existed but I knew people and then the final thing to answer kind of the journey question Paul is that
[00:12:35] [SPEAKER_01]: I moved from being the call center head to the head of like transformation as the organization was
[00:12:40] [SPEAKER_01]: one's age and we were looking as part of that job I had real estate global real estate under me and
[00:12:48] [SPEAKER_01]: the covid pandemic happened George Flores and it was on about the 20s and that's 2020 yeah exactly
[00:12:56] [SPEAKER_01]: about 20s I was on a call with the CEO and the CFO of the organization and they said how's the
[00:13:04] [SPEAKER_01]: real estate looking because we had to cut call and at that point in time that's when that George
[00:13:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Floyd video was playing over and over and over on the news I was in my New York City often
[00:13:13] [SPEAKER_01]: relate you can relate I had the two pictures of my two little black boys on the desk and I'm on
[00:13:18] [SPEAKER_01]: the phone call and I was like what the hell is what we're talking about getting sure that what's happened
[00:13:24] [SPEAKER_01]: on that TV is not been for my little amen yeah I picked up the phone call my brother as he was
[00:13:31] [SPEAKER_01]: a partner at a DC law firm and I said do you want to go out and change the world and we dropped
[00:13:36] [SPEAKER_01]: our two week notice right after that I know that's just so exciting that is all right in the
[00:13:45] [SPEAKER_01]: birds brothers agency now that has a whole bunch of different companies under it but it's all
[00:13:50] [SPEAKER_01]: around how do we create change through understanding and then each company drives understanding
[00:13:56] [SPEAKER_04]: and connection for ways yes but can I just throw in there just two seconds because I want to go
[00:14:03] [SPEAKER_04]: a little bit rewind and back to what you said in your military days because you sugarcoded it
[00:14:09] [SPEAKER_04]: yes Mike and his wife who I know as well Heather who's an extremely good or great athlete
[00:14:18] [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know what happened to Mike but she does try out long and she's like kicking butt
[00:14:23] [SPEAKER_04]: kicking ass in it too as well. When he failed to mention is to be an aviator or pilot it's freaking
[00:14:31] [SPEAKER_04]: hard to get that's what he forgot to mention no it's important to mention that because it's not
[00:14:36] [SPEAKER_04]: anybody can be a pilot right so exactly you know talk talk that up and just you know massage over
[00:14:43] [SPEAKER_04]: a little bit because it's a long it's it's a tough course and not everything I'm going to take
[00:14:49] [SPEAKER_01]: that problem I'm gonna take it in my pocket because I know I'm really appreciate that
[00:14:55] [SPEAKER_03]: no actually I have a question though for you Mike in that what was the what was the time
[00:15:00] [SPEAKER_03]: frame between the transition of when you left the military until when you got that position
[00:15:04] [SPEAKER_03]: in city group because for a lot of for a lot of folks that do end up leaving the military
[00:15:08] [SPEAKER_03]: it is a big jump to go from the military into the corporate world so how long did it take you
[00:15:14] [SPEAKER_01]: to find that position with city group. So to find it so no more than about six months right okay
[00:15:22] [SPEAKER_01]: because I was like looking on the web like we all do if I've got jobs opportunities and and
[00:15:28] [SPEAKER_01]: and I said well I gotta figure out a job that I will love like doing the work that good it's hard
[00:15:35] [SPEAKER_01]: to move and we're a lot of military folks fail as you move to a space to work for 15 20 you
[00:15:40] [SPEAKER_01]: know how many years you've been like serving right it's all about it bigger than yourself
[00:15:44] [SPEAKER_01]: and then to go to something that's has nothing to do with that it's really hard
[00:15:48] [SPEAKER_01]: and so I had to find something at least allowed me to do something that was bigger to myself
[00:15:53] [SPEAKER_01]: and so and then leverage kind of that's the diversity thing because I knew it was
[00:15:57] [SPEAKER_01]: when the people were interested in and so I saw the city opportunity
[00:16:01] [SPEAKER_01]: unlinked it and then I did some folks at my life new because she was in financial services who I knew
[00:16:06] [SPEAKER_01]: and and really found some advocates to kind of speak up for me inside
[00:16:12] [SPEAKER_01]: and really kind of help push through my nomination yeah you're just a people I'm there is no way
[00:16:19] [SPEAKER_02]: I was gonna get oh okay yeah no it's definitely the network yeah clearly yeah and clearly
[00:16:24] [SPEAKER_04]: diversity and inclusion is the big deal I I'll be remiss if I did not give you another
[00:16:31] [SPEAKER_04]: thing to put in your pocket Mike because you also fail to mention which I was hoping you would have
[00:16:37] [SPEAKER_04]: is that between you and I because I was the marketing guy at West Point while we were there we
[00:16:43] [SPEAKER_04]: increased diversity the highest number of female ever in the school's history as well as Hispanics
[00:16:53] [SPEAKER_04]: and we also increased African Americans going to West Point yeah so I had the idea
[00:17:01] [SPEAKER_01]: and it was really a team thing and always part of that team as well but yeah
[00:17:07] [SPEAKER_02]: black Latino that's important yeah oh yeah oh well so I want to ask specifically for one of your
[00:17:15] [SPEAKER_02]: brands global talent Africa so like we started a series on just understanding Africa better
[00:17:22] [SPEAKER_02]: because for the three of us we've been there and we have these misconceptions about what is there
[00:17:28] [SPEAKER_02]: and so how does your company the global talent Africa piece try to because you had said
[00:17:34] [SPEAKER_02]: do you want to demystify this this continent and just make it more accessible and so we're I just
[00:17:39] [SPEAKER_01]: want to know how you guys are doing that so we find that in order to dismiss the mystified things
[00:17:46] [SPEAKER_01]: you can like come up with websites and videos and yeah all sorts of cool marketing material but
[00:17:52] [SPEAKER_01]: there's nothing like feeling it touching it breathing it Africa like change it you and I'm sure
[00:17:59] [SPEAKER_01]: when you all been there as well like it changes you no matter who you are no matter where you're
[00:18:04] [SPEAKER_01]: from and so for us we knew it was going to be important because global talent Africa's mission is
[00:18:09] [SPEAKER_01]: how do we decrease the unemployment rate on the continent of Africa and allow this amazing
[00:18:16] [SPEAKER_01]: talent that's there that's more educated more motivated than most talent around the globe how
[00:18:21] [SPEAKER_01]: do we give them a chance to really lean into the skills that they bring to the table and the only
[00:18:26] [SPEAKER_01]: way to do that is through opportunity and we have a saying that you know talent is distributed
[00:18:31] [SPEAKER_01]: equally opportunity is not right and so we want to demystify and change and then by doing so
[00:18:38] [SPEAKER_01]: give these young people opportunity we have to bring people who have the opportunity to the
[00:18:43] [SPEAKER_01]: continent and so we do a lot of trips and bring a lot of Fortune 100 Fortune 500
[00:18:49] [SPEAKER_01]: organizations that are already pushing work all around the world we bring them to Africa
[00:18:54] [SPEAKER_01]: so they can see so they can smell so they can touch and so they can actually experience the talent
[00:18:58] [SPEAKER_01]: and nine times out of ten when they leave there is a hundred if not a thousand life
[00:19:04] [SPEAKER_01]: that have been changed because those people will now employ some of the people that they they
[00:19:09] [SPEAKER_02]: would have never met any other one time that's all yeah and we've heard that said by
[00:19:16] [SPEAKER_02]: all anyone that's ever been down for because says that exact same thing that it changes you
[00:19:21] [SPEAKER_01]: so I want to go no that's not that's not that is we should figure out we should do a rhythm and role
[00:19:30] [SPEAKER_01]: yes we're just talking about that we were just talking about that
[00:19:33] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm writing it up
[00:19:36] [SPEAKER_04]: rhythm and role in Africa yeah let me let me tag on to what the net had to say Mike on so
[00:19:46] [SPEAKER_04]: clearly you guys are doing some good some great stuff but before you ever actually because I think
[00:19:51] [SPEAKER_04]: we also had you know little talks about this before you even step foot in the african stuff like
[00:19:57] [SPEAKER_04]: what what were some you know misconceptions you had about Africa before even traveling to Africa
[00:20:03] [SPEAKER_04]: and how did you end up addressing or dealing with it so I'll be completely open it on us with
[00:20:10] [SPEAKER_01]: everyone I thought Africa was dirt roads I thought Africa was people who were hungry
[00:20:16] [SPEAKER_01]: who were begging I thought Africa was everything that like the 1980s kind of like commercial
[00:20:25] [SPEAKER_01]: media said Africa yeah Africa you always hear Africa's full of corruption and part of it
[00:20:32] [SPEAKER_01]: up you feel Africa has no like technological infrastructure like nothing happened that's exactly
[00:20:38] [SPEAKER_01]: what I thought Africa was and at the place I ever went to in Africa was Durbin and Durbin is basically
[00:20:48] [SPEAKER_01]: like York like mixed with like cell balo it's like big cool trendy you know space metropolitan
[00:20:58] [SPEAKER_01]: that's right then area and I was like this is not what I thought and then I walked into our partner's
[00:21:04] [SPEAKER_01]: office and the only way I could get in is through retinal scan wow that's like high technology
[00:21:15] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah and then every step I took a different misconception was like scratching yes yeah
[00:21:23] [SPEAKER_01]: and then the final thing was you hear that okay I've been in it they're not educated right
[00:21:29] [SPEAKER_01]: and then I send a room with people that are like call center agents and I asked them like to
[00:21:34] [SPEAKER_01]: have an education to go to college 100% of people raise their hand right and they're call center
[00:21:39] [SPEAKER_01]: okay that's right 100% and I was like what year's degree and oh I'm a CPA I'm a lawyer right
[00:21:46] [SPEAKER_01]: like you have these are real like like and these are people who are hourly calls center workers right
[00:21:52] [SPEAKER_01]: like call center workers right and what they did before me and no offense like McDonald's
[00:21:58] [SPEAKER_01]: and all these but like they were a cashier at McDonald's before they came to the call center they
[00:22:03] [SPEAKER_01]: weren't lawyers CPAs you know finance professionals and that was the final kind of misconception
[00:22:10] [SPEAKER_01]: of like this just no education not only was that not that was just scratched out it was actually
[00:22:14] [SPEAKER_03]: just completely thrown off the table sure wow that that is blowing my mind to think that they're
[00:22:22] [SPEAKER_03]: that there's so much potential and there's so many educated folks but because of the opportunities
[00:22:29] [SPEAKER_03]: that aren't that aren't there in your own home country that you cannot make a living there you can't
[00:22:37] [SPEAKER_03]: you can't be who you are or destined to be who you are where you are so you have to leave
[00:22:42] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah says really interesting I'll admit this as well and and Paul knows I've really not good at like
[00:22:48] [SPEAKER_01]: holding my tongue in my thoughts and so it's the edit of the film right now oh good that's all good
[00:22:59] [SPEAKER_01]: still has this we're relationship with people of color especially like black people
[00:23:04] [SPEAKER_01]: and and and there are shock black people more than the continent of Africa
[00:23:10] [SPEAKER_01]: and so I think a lot of like the hesitation some of it's hide to miss perceptions right but some
[00:23:16] [SPEAKER_01]: of it's tied to like just right fear right because there's probably little diligence is done around
[00:23:22] [SPEAKER_01]: India or little diligence is done around Guatemala or little diligence is on around other
[00:23:27] [SPEAKER_01]: parts of the world where the US and the Western World for World Cup are well without a whole
[00:23:31] [SPEAKER_01]: bunch of knowledge to pour in but in Africa it was always a little different like there's always
[00:23:36] [SPEAKER_01]: the same way the checks that the black folks in the US have to have like it's magnified
[00:23:43] [SPEAKER_01]: exemplified there's a combination with misperception but also think it's how the Western world views people
[00:23:51] [SPEAKER_04]: of color no no you touched on yeah you touched on a sticky not a sticky point but a point
[00:23:57] [SPEAKER_04]: we've made a couple of times in other episodes of our podcast and one recently that I can
[00:24:03] [SPEAKER_04]: remember that I recall was we were talking about you know when we think of Africa you know what
[00:24:08] [SPEAKER_04]: do you think of the kind of the question I asked you and the first thing that you know we I would say
[00:24:13] [SPEAKER_04]: and we said was you know people look at it and it's negative compared to you know Europe
[00:24:20] [SPEAKER_04]: why do we find that there's nothing bad in Europe and I'm like I'm all the way to the Eastern
[00:24:25] [SPEAKER_04]: like I've been a Lithuania and didn't feel fear but you know you say I want to go to Africa
[00:24:32] [SPEAKER_04]: then all of a sudden the fear comes over and I think exactly I think to as well you know how they
[00:24:37] [SPEAKER_04]: thought us and it's embedded in our heads that believe that this is bad kind of the so
[00:24:42] [SPEAKER_03]: I appreciate so like now that you know you've had some time now in Africa and you've now seen
[00:24:48] [SPEAKER_03]: these things and you've kind of had the opportunity to kind of immerse yourselves with people you know
[00:24:54] [SPEAKER_03]: and about introduced people to Africa what what are some of the significant changes and
[00:24:59] [SPEAKER_03]: developments that you've seen you know that really kind of impressed you in Africa now that you've
[00:25:05] [SPEAKER_01]: had that opportunity well and you mean from the people who we brought or from the kind of
[00:25:12] [SPEAKER_03]: just you and just you in general like what has what is just really wild you just something that
[00:25:16] [SPEAKER_03]: has just been really significant that you know development wise or any changes or just just
[00:25:21] [SPEAKER_03]: from the time that you've been there or you've you've immersed yourself I love like the culture right
[00:25:30] [SPEAKER_01]: just it's just the culture is strong and it's it's really interesting how much of like the
[00:25:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Western world like culture is embraced by those in Africa like they know every artist musical
[00:25:44] [SPEAKER_01]: artists they know every actor they watch the films they have the slang they're the biggest users
[00:25:49] [SPEAKER_01]: of social media like between Latin America like like they are fully present I think that's just
[00:25:57] [SPEAKER_01]: an really really cool but the other thing is it's like the love that's there right is that
[00:26:05] [SPEAKER_01]: when you talk to a young person in Africa and ask them you're going to do with your first paycheck
[00:26:10] [SPEAKER_01]: it's not I'm going to go on and buy a new pair of jays right like some people right
[00:26:15] [SPEAKER_01]: but all of it is you know I'm going to spin my paycheck to ensure that my mom doesn't have to
[00:26:21] [SPEAKER_01]: you know buy groceries this week or I'm going to figure out inside of my village how I
[00:26:27] [SPEAKER_01]: you know distribute my first pay it's never like about them the individual first and it's so
[00:26:33] [SPEAKER_01]: refreshing and it goes back to like we're we're really military it's all about bigger
[00:26:39] [SPEAKER_01]: side of the bigger than yourself and so I feel comfortable there because the mentality
[00:26:44] [SPEAKER_01]: is the exact same as the mentality that I have. That's amazing yeah no I like it it's like so
[00:26:52] [SPEAKER_02]: is it are they very community based that you've noticed yeah absolutely it's all about the community
[00:27:00] [SPEAKER_01]: right and there was a stat which I'll screw up but there was an ormany thing that ran like
[00:27:07] [SPEAKER_01]: how far does a dollar touch inside of a community are oh and like the in the North America
[00:27:14] [SPEAKER_01]: a dollar will touch I think it's like 3.5 people right like it will pass yeah in like place like
[00:27:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Africa it touches like 10 people right so further to impact so benefit kind of ties to
[00:27:28] [SPEAKER_01]: your community it's all about how does what I get how does it make those around wow I love that
[00:27:35] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean and so for for people in America or whoever's listening to this like how can we
[00:27:41] [SPEAKER_02]: get more involved how can we support your efforts or efforts that you would recommend
[00:27:46] [SPEAKER_02]: we support because there's there's so much to do in that comment for for people like does
[00:27:52] [SPEAKER_01]: you have resources but you know what it's like I mean it can be like that that that boy the
[00:27:59] [SPEAKER_01]: ocean mentality you can catch up in right there's just so much so much to get over wellman where
[00:28:03] [SPEAKER_01]: I even start and then if it becomes too overwhelming that you just don't start at all right and so
[00:28:09] [SPEAKER_01]: exactly I would say that for me the first is like figure out how do you get on the continent
[00:28:17] [SPEAKER_01]: right you don't have to like travel the continent you don't have to go like to multiple places but like
[00:28:21] [SPEAKER_01]: just go one time if you can and just touch it feel it walk it interact right I think I think
[00:28:28] [SPEAKER_01]: that is a way to get involved because doing that will cause you to be emotionally connected to
[00:28:33] [SPEAKER_01]: whatever your next step is because if you're emotionally connected you might do one thing or two things
[00:28:39] [SPEAKER_01]: in a short term but long term you're not going to be doing anything and so I would recommend
[00:28:46] [SPEAKER_01]: try to get there and then once you're there then even if you did do anything but like just tell
[00:28:51] [SPEAKER_01]: the goodness after that that would be enough because if enough people start changing the narrative
[00:28:58] [SPEAKER_01]: and people start hearing that narrative coming from especially people that they never would think
[00:29:02] [SPEAKER_01]: would say it you know most likely are the people of the whole expect must say it but they don't
[00:29:07] [SPEAKER_01]: make it right 65 year old white male CEO to like say it but we get more people to start just talking
[00:29:14] [SPEAKER_04]: differently about the continent I think that ripple effect you know yeah you tell us a young woman
[00:29:21] [SPEAKER_04]: that I know from high school or both Trisha and I know from high school doctor Dewan I'm
[00:29:27] [SPEAKER_04]: yelled to one and trying to act and everything like that I always say she's my sister from another
[00:29:32] [SPEAKER_04]: mother because she did exactly that and she always does that whenever she talks to someone
[00:29:38] [SPEAKER_04]: like she's telling me how African like she's telling she's sending me pictures and videos of her
[00:29:44] [SPEAKER_04]: in Rwanda clearly you know not only me but a lot of people when they think of Rwanda they do
[00:29:50] [SPEAKER_04]: not think of cross for you know if you need to think of hotel Rwanda like I did you know so
[00:29:57] [SPEAKER_04]: you're right it's enough people and word of mouth is very very important so I'm glad you mentioned
[00:30:03] [SPEAKER_04]: that because that is important and I'm sick and tired of the fear mongering of people are just fear
[00:30:10] [SPEAKER_04]: of going to Africa right because of the misconceptions right so so my tell us about
[00:30:18] [SPEAKER_03]: so my tell us about some upcoming projects and or some developments or things that you all are
[00:30:23] [SPEAKER_03]: doing with the burn spreaders projects well like what's what's going on like what's going on with
[00:30:27] [SPEAKER_01]: the group and yeah we have a lot sometimes we feel like we're exciting things so on the theme of
[00:30:33] [SPEAKER_01]: Africa we have an idea of mentioned this is kind of in detail like our sub businesses but one of
[00:30:38] [SPEAKER_01]: our sub businesses is a social club called HQ and HQ we built it as a community because we all know
[00:30:45] [SPEAKER_01]: like the civil houses and things like that and we felt as like professionals specifically professionals
[00:30:50] [SPEAKER_01]: of color you like walk into these places like the south house and you're a member of it like you
[00:30:55] [SPEAKER_01]: don't really quite feel like you could be your authentic self in those spaces and so
[00:31:00] [SPEAKER_01]: especially Washington DC where you have so many you know black and brown professionals there
[00:31:06] [SPEAKER_01]: like we built they needed a space to come and kind of truly take off their jackets and their armor
[00:31:12] [SPEAKER_01]: and just be because they're often the onlys in any room right so we created that there and now
[00:31:18] [SPEAKER_01]: so our doing the same thing in Kenya and so we're building a physical HQ Kenya it's actually in a new
[00:31:24] [SPEAKER_01]: city called tattoo city and so that that will be open here in the next three months we're
[00:31:31] [SPEAKER_01]: built open in a restaurant in DC and ages you brought with a chef by the name of Tim Ma we're open
[00:31:37] [SPEAKER_01]: at China town and we're doing it not only because it's connected to our HQ location in DC but the
[00:31:42] [SPEAKER_01]: narrative that comes with you know a black business partner in with an Asian chef inside of
[00:31:49] [SPEAKER_01]: China town because we know the Asian community like building that narrative of partnership to
[00:31:55] [SPEAKER_01]: drive change for roof food and bringing people together once again our whole theme it might come different
[00:32:00] [SPEAKER_01]: a restaurant might be different but the theme of driving understanding is the same that's awesome
[00:32:06] [SPEAKER_01]: and so those are the sounds yummy yeah yeah and everybody on this call will absolutely be invited
[00:32:12] [SPEAKER_01]: and then the last thing we want to kind of brag about record that yeah you heard it here first
[00:32:18] [SPEAKER_01]: but the last thing to kind of brag about that we're super excited about to go to the back to the HQ
[00:32:22] [SPEAKER_01]: theme is that we're building the same called the HQ global network and we're doing it through like
[00:32:27] [SPEAKER_01]: a digital like platform like a social network to our goal is how do we bring together one
[00:32:32] [SPEAKER_01]: million black professionals across the globe and we think if you do that then not only drives
[00:32:38] [SPEAKER_01]: community but it helps us to control our narrative I'm a big believer that at some point in time
[00:32:44] [SPEAKER_01]: we as black folks can't allow our narrative be positioning controlled by others and so a new
[00:32:50] [SPEAKER_01]: local network it's all about center mass and like having the volume like the people who have
[00:32:56] [SPEAKER_01]: like usually when change comes it's tied to you hitting on the certain number of people
[00:33:01] [SPEAKER_01]: driving towards the same action right and so we'll get all these people together and people
[00:33:06] [SPEAKER_01]: of color will be the majority of folks around the globe now you can start really positioning and
[00:33:11] [SPEAKER_01]: drive in the change that you want to see not waiting for others to determine they want to lean
[00:33:16] [SPEAKER_01]: into support of you in the chain. That's right yeah now that is very sunsue with center of mass
[00:33:26] [SPEAKER_04]: yes no I love that no I definitely like it and that's good stuff Mike and look
[00:33:33] [SPEAKER_04]: I mean before because I think we you know got to the crux of a lot of the questions that we
[00:33:38] [SPEAKER_04]: wanted to ask you and stuff like that but before you know we come to the ending of everything
[00:33:44] [SPEAKER_04]: I wanted to just give the floor to you and tell us you know there's anything that you want
[00:33:50] [SPEAKER_04]: to you know obviously free flow and and say about this topic as well as anything you want
[00:33:58] [SPEAKER_01]: to throw out there with your company as well. Well what I will say it and so when we had a chance
[00:34:04] [SPEAKER_01]: to talk before one of the things that I really love about what you all are doing is actually in
[00:34:11] [SPEAKER_01]: parallel with a question you all asked me about you know Africa and my response being well sometimes
[00:34:17] [SPEAKER_01]: you've got to go there and feel it and I think a lot of times that walls won't be knocked down
[00:34:23] [SPEAKER_01]: perceptions won't be erased connections won't be made if they're not made in like a physical
[00:34:30] [SPEAKER_01]: space through kind of risk of being unknown right and and and I really admire what's happening here
[00:34:39] [SPEAKER_01]: because people of color especially are very risk adverse travelin.
[00:34:45] [SPEAKER_01]: I always joke and maybe we talked about this before is that when I was at West Point
[00:34:50] [SPEAKER_01]: they allow you like your junior year the like travel and going get these immersive experiences
[00:34:56] [SPEAKER_01]: and I didn't even take advantage of it. I said well I'd rather just sit in my room with my buddy
[00:35:01] [SPEAKER_01]: but I'm not making it right and everybody who didn't like everybody who looked like me
[00:35:06] [SPEAKER_01]: most of them did the exact same thing yep this is true. Who did not look like me
[00:35:12] [SPEAKER_01]: comfortable going to Europe and India and all these other amazing opportunities at West Point was
[00:35:16] [SPEAKER_01]: given them and so even to this day I consider myself educated I consider myself smart
[00:35:23] [SPEAKER_01]: and I'm still like afraid of like stepping out and I wouldn't even if once I find addition
[00:35:29] [SPEAKER_01]: a restaurant I don't change that right like I don't like doing things that I don't know
[00:35:34] [SPEAKER_01]: and so I know you can hire folks that go out there and enrich their lives and buy and
[00:35:39] [SPEAKER_01]: they live say change the perspectives of others and so I respect what you all are doing
[00:35:44] [SPEAKER_01]: and I want to support it however I can because I think it goes back to that ripple and
[00:35:52] [SPEAKER_01]: the more people who see opportunity, why people people of color travel to places then it
[00:35:59] [SPEAKER_01]: starts to give maybe not mic permission but it starts giving my two boys permission because they see
[00:36:05] [SPEAKER_04]: no no that's I'm sorry. Yeah I mean I know we definitely appreciate that and you just motivated
[00:36:12] [SPEAKER_04]: to hell out of me and inspired me on a lot of the stuff you just said because you know obviously
[00:36:19] [SPEAKER_04]: look where we are at right now literally we're on different states and continent you know
[00:36:26] [SPEAKER_04]: Colorado Texas New York Paris and and before we close I just wanted to add on to what you just
[00:36:36] [SPEAKER_04]: said about the fact that hey look because I'm doing it and being you know obviously a black man
[00:36:42] [SPEAKER_04]: and I'm just telling you look go to these places go here go there I'm freaking living here regardless
[00:36:50] [SPEAKER_04]: if there's gonna be there's gonna be negativity against you you're just gonna have this and
[00:36:54] [SPEAKER_04]: we talked about this two one-on-one two Mike whenever we hang out or something like that you know
[00:36:59] [SPEAKER_04]: you just gotta like I'm always in the same mindset of Nike just do it because I had that fear to
[00:37:06] [SPEAKER_04]: as well the only difference between me going through you know regular university and you guys
[00:37:11] [SPEAKER_04]: going through academies y'all had money to go ahead and do it they're like here's free money go do it
[00:37:16] [SPEAKER_04]: well I was in college and we had the same opportunities but I was just afraid because uh
[00:37:23] [SPEAKER_04]: because I don't have the money and then I didn't want to be I felt like I was gonna be embarrassed
[00:37:28] [SPEAKER_04]: because I'm somewhere where I'm not the miljuin and I want to change the narrative on that
[00:37:34] [SPEAKER_04]: hence why I'm here and I'm you know we start this podcast to as well of letting folks know
[00:37:41] [SPEAKER_04]: culture and travel we can do with this shit to as well and just do absolutely absolutely
[00:37:48] [SPEAKER_01]: and have absolutely right you I mean it's not going to support any fear is so
[00:37:54] [SPEAKER_01]: I think that people that don't like look like us have been programmed to be a lot more to
[00:38:00] [SPEAKER_01]: lean into a risk a lot more because they know they have a support structure so if they fall
[00:38:04] [SPEAKER_01]: in the pick-up up yeah like we because we haven't necessarily always had the support structure
[00:38:10] [SPEAKER_01]: and things are like for the known we start to be programmed just not to take risks exactly right
[00:38:15] [SPEAKER_01]: or you know Vanessa Trish's Paul there are out there you start to create like the safety net
[00:38:21] [SPEAKER_01]: for folks because I know if I fall inside of like Paris like Paul there right yeah yeah
[00:38:27] [SPEAKER_01]: well and I think I think that's also important and that will start giving people not only permission
[00:38:32] [SPEAKER_01]: to do it but like discomfort that they know what they do do it and they kind of fall into
[00:38:37] [SPEAKER_01]: it really is it's gonna be somebody there to patch them up sure absolutely and I think that's a great
[00:38:43] [SPEAKER_04]: segue into ending this awesome discussion Mike I really appreciate you taking the time out
[00:38:49] [SPEAKER_04]: of your busy schedule to like you know hook us up and be on here to chat with us a bit more about
[00:38:55] [SPEAKER_04]: Africa and you know demystifying a lot of the things that that you know folks might have about
[00:39:02] [SPEAKER_04]: the continent that being said I want to thank our listeners and our viewers
[00:39:08] [SPEAKER_04]: as always please if you have any comments or if you haven't already like subscribe and as
[00:39:17] [SPEAKER_04]: always we appreciate any support and please provide us with any feedback you have so until next time
[00:39:25] [SPEAKER_04]: that is wow